Latin Mass on Christmas? Yes! 2 Latin Masses!
St. Thomas the Apostle, Irondequoit; Latin Christmas Mass at 11:15AM Picture by Bernie
St. Francis Church in Phelps. Latin Christmas Mass 11:00AM
As we look forward to the magnificence of our upcoming Christmas celebrations, I’d like to re-introduce the words of Pope Benedict from his book “Spirit of the Liturgy” and inquire how others view the application to our local parishes. Scroll down past the picture to read one local pastor’s “answer” to the issue in his parish. What do you think of it?
How did one priest handle the desire for his parishioners to be recognized for their accomplishment, participation or contribution to the celebration, but still honor the words of Pope Benedict? At the end of Mass he asks the attendees to pray for God’s blessing on, for example, “the choir for sharing the gifts God has given them with the entire community,” and invokes a blessing upon them. Result? The contribution duly noted, with blessing rather than applause! What do you think? Would you rather have a blessing or applause?
Basilian Departure:
On December 4th, the Ticker offered Bishop Matano’s letter to the parishioners of St. Kateri Tekawitha announcing the departure of the Basilian Fathers from the Rochester Diocese next July. That information can now be found here. To find articles on Cleansing Fire on related matters, search “Basilian.” The loss of Fr. Joe Lanzalaco in 2015 was indeed a devastating impact on the local community, but so too were multiple issues around the Basilian Management of St. Kateri Parish, both in-parish and in-community (search zoning applications and hearings in Irondequoit for details and the neighbors’ reactions).
While the pastoral assistance of the Basilians was surely appreciated during leaner times, especially in chaplaincy at St. John Fisher, which staffing should continue for a while, one can see how the Diocese of Rochester is stronger today, on Bp. Matano’s watch, and able to accommodate such a departure. Other related search words in the general media include (Fr.) Rosica, a Basilian and Rochester native, who pops up in the Pope’s news from time-to-time with pro-gay attributions, and also Basilian Father William Hodgson Marshall, who was convicted in 2011 of abusing 17 students at schools over a 38-year period. He had worked in Rochester, Toronto, Windsor, Sudbury, and Sault Ste. Marie, being moved 5x in his career. News reports said he was “reported” a total of six times over his career but continued in his role as a priest and teacher. A Toronto judge awarded one victim $2.5 million, but earlier in 2018 it was appealed by the Basilian Fathers.
In more recent times, one locally owned Basilian property, their mansion at 3497 East Avenue, was apparently sold, which should provide the order with additional financial resources.
What other Ticker Posts do you want to discuss?
|
Regarding the Basilians leaving, this puts the Latin mass community in an interesting position, as whomever Bishop Matano selects will be head of the cluster, and therefore the head of our community… Prayers that the priest assigned will have a good relationship with our community and will help us to grow!
Actually, this is a very good time to break up St. Kateri into two parishes. It is already badly divided. I think St. Albans should go to St. Thomas, and with the Latin Mass and the St. Thomas returnees from the 4 year exile, should be one stand alone parish. That would also help to get some daily Masses into St. Thomas so it could become again a real parish.
Hopeful, I don’t know if the Latin mass community is considered financially stable enough to be given pariah status. We are basically a pariah in everything but name, but St. Kateri manages our finances. We have to go through their administration for that.
The Latin Mass attendance really hasn’t changed since the days it was held at St. Stanislaus.
The days of the stand alone parish are gone. Even the few stand alone parishes left in the suburbs will soon have to start sharing a priest. And we don’t even know how many retirements there will be next June.
https://rcav.org/wp-content/uploads/BC-and-Yukon-Bishops-Statement-on-the-Legalization-of-Marijuana-in-Canada.pdf
Perhaps the Latin Mass Community should stop standing apart from other faithful Catholics and be absorbed into parish life. You are not pariahs, but you stand apart by your own stance that you cannot abide the Novus Ordo, and that’s perhaps grounds for pariah status, since that is offensive to we Catholics who do not feel our beautifully prayed non-Latin Mass is also pleasing to God. This whole laity-made division could be resolved by parish clusters serving us with offering a Latin Mass each weekend. Surely with these two and three and more church clusters, one of the churches in each and every cluster could offer a weekly Latin Mass. This thing of separating for perceived specialness needs to stop. Okay…. now I’m ducking because a cascade of bricks is surely headed my way! But please know that I’ve spoken up in charity. Parishes need parishioners, and this separateness cannot be called brotherly love. The bishop could and IMHO should facilitate a weekly Latin Mass in all parishes… and in between the other Masses, not out somewhere in left field… and put an end to this separatist stuff, which serves no one and is not what Jesus prayed for.
The first part of this comment by Ginger has been deleted. It was unfortunately in direct contradiction to an Apostolic Letter of His Holiness, Pope Benedict XVI. The remainder of Ginger’s comment remains. Any replies to the prior content will also be deleted. Thank you for your understanding. Administrator
Can anyone believe the Bishops of of Yukon Canada wrote a statement on legalization of marijuana? I posted the link a few messages ago. I am very thankful to see this but wow! These are very treacherous times.
I will add these two recent published news stories that are very directly related to ever increasing problem of licit and illicit drugs.
https://www.foxnews.com/us/finding-jesus-chapo-carries-bible-highlighting-complex-relationship-between-church-and-carte
https://www.foxnews.com/world/cruelty-of-el-chapos-sinaloa-cartel-knows-no-bounds-beheadings-by-chainsaw-body-parts-strewn-in-the-streets
I won’t read or contribute anymore. I see now how exclusive the users/readership is.
My mistake.
JLo’s comment deserves a reply. If it were attacking the Latin Mass per se, I would ask that it be removed. Rather, it is more of an attack against the people who like or even prefer the Latin Mass. JLo attributes motives that are, in my experience, untrue, and oversimplifies an extremely complex situation. I considered writing a long comment to cover a number of points (yes, this is the short version!), but decided that a separate post would be a better way to go. Within the next day or two, I’ll upload a broader perspective.
Bur first, JLo’s comments about the Latin Mass Community must at least briefly be addressed here. In Rochester, “The Latin Mass Community” pertains to one and perhaps only one community; the attendees of the Latin Mass each Sunday and Holy Day at St. Thomas the Apostle Church, a member church of the cluster of St. Kateri. Should they feel singled out by JLo’s comments? Yes, I think so.
Most of the former parishioners of St. Thomas the Apostle do recognize that they would never have been re-opened if the critical ‘mass’ of the Latin Mass attendees (from St. Stanislaus) had not been moved to the STA parishioner base by Bishop Matano. Our bishop deserves praise, not criticism, for the extraordinary (pun intended) effort he has made for both communities, and their ability to work together is noteworthy. I would say that steady progress has been made, even if not ‘perfect progress,’ toward the mutual respect between two groups. IMO, the ‘division’ is not for the most part between attendee groups at St. Thomas, but between the members of other St. Kateri Churches who have misused and abused the parishioners at St. Thomas, time and time again.
There is no point in detailing the repeated harassment here, and there is much hope that a new pastor for St. Kateri will be able to bridge the gap for the entire parish, as Fr. Bonsignore has been able to do within St. Thomas. I want to make very clear that Fr. Bonsignore’s response to the challenge of tending both the “English Mass” and “Latin Mass” communities is based on his being able to celebrate the Novus Ordo with tremendous respect, a respect which echoes the reverence of centuries. (More in the new post to come, especially on the misunderstandings about the Latin Mass).
The target of attacks against the Latin Mass is broader than one group of parishioners – it also includes, at least implicitly, every priest who has made the effort to celebrate and preserve the Latin Mass and over 1000 years of traditional worship. The price of preserving the Latin Mass? Ask Thomas More, John Fisher, Edmund Campion “Why wasn’t the Anglican Mass ‘good enough’?” so they could have saved their own lives?
JLo’s accusations include the following:
• “Perhaps the Latin Mass Community should stop standing apart from other faithful Catholics and be absorbed into parish life.” The situation at St. Thomas the Apostle shows the fallacy of the accusation. The accusation is a betrayal of all the work that has been done in that parish since Bp. Matano’s vote of confidence by bringing the two groups together. Words you use like “pariah” are rude and divisive.
• “By your own stance …you can’t abide the Novus Ordo” This is a direct accusation about people’s motives and feelings and is uncharitable and uncalled for. Many attendees at Latin Mass also go to Mass 6 other days a week. Where do you think they go, JLo? The Novus Ordo, of course. But most try to go to a well-celebrated, filled with reverence Novus Ordo (more on that in the post to come.) So, since many Latin Mass attendees do attend the Novus Ordo, but most Novus Ordo attendees do not attend the Latin Mass, just which group is taking a stance of separateness? Of what JLo calls “perceived specialness?” or “separatist stuff?”
• “The bishop could and IMHO should facilitate a weekly Latin Mass in all parishes….” And where is he supposed to find enough priests to be able to take your recommendation? He has taken an important step with St. Thomas the Apostle. It isn’t clear how your recommendation could work. What should happen, I believe, is what Bp. Morlino did by requiring all seminarians to at least LEARN how to say the Latin Mass; the Church’s own tradition.
It would be amusing, if not also so sad, that so many attendees of let’s say “The English Mass” see a Latin Mass as divisive but what about the other 20 rites of the Catholic Church, whose liturgies may be even more “different” from the Novus Ordo? Why aren’t we (or haven’t been for 2 millennia) concerned that those rites are divisive? The “tent” into which we are all called by Baptism (and THAT varies from rite to rite as well) is a very large tent, as we notice when we read about the crushing blow about to come upon the Chinese underground Catholics, and as has been waged against Syrian Catholics, and the destruction of their culture. The Church is ONE, and it’s up to us to better understand what that means and how to be part of her.
Immaculate Mary, pray for us.
JLo, I agree with you, but I must be clear that not ALL of the attendees of SKT-Latin Mass Community are as you say. Many of them (myself and my husband included) support and attend reverent Novus Ordo masses, as well as the Ordinariate.
I agree that parishes SHOULD offer a weekly Latin mass. Is this likely to happen in the future? Unlikely, given the lack of formation in seminary to properly celebrate the Latin mass.
Bishop Matano should take the lead and reform the seminary process so our seminarians could be able to celebrate the Latin mass out of the gate, so to speak. As far as I know, he knows how to celebrate it, but has not done so in this diocese.
He will be coming to SKT-LMC for Gaudete Sunday on December 16th, and will be at both masses. Perhaps we could encourage him and support him in possible celebrating the Latin mass at SKT-LMC in the future? It would be edifying for attendees of BOTH masses to see him actively taking part.
Thank you, SamanthGillenson, for understanding my comments and the spirit in which I wrote, i,e, so wishing that such a division was not needed, that people could choose either Roman rite in all our parishes/clusters. Dreaming? Perhaps, but wishes are also prayers. As to Diane Harris, I did not deserve your particular bricks, even if you disagree, like, and accept the separations, and my comments had absolutely nothing to do with the politics involved in the particulars of where the Latin Mass Community now meets and the trials that have racked St. Thomas. I pray all seminarians are learning both Latin rites and that one day my wish will be realized and Diane Harris can pack away this particular righteous indignation. Peace.
Well, at least my indignation is righteous. Thank you for that, JLo.
I have no interest in defending myself, only the Mass and what is holy.
Isaiah 5:16; Wisdom 6:10a
Oh wow. Now I’m thinking I should have suggested SELF-righteous. I think I’ll take a cue from Ginger and sign off this site. So disappointing.
The disclaimer, to which each user who logs into Cleansing Fire agrees, includes the following language: “… site administration may, in its sole judgment, remove content, in part or in whole, for any reason, including but not limited to spamming, false information, improper accusation, rude or profane language, content inconsistent with Catholic Teaching, or possible violation of civil or Canon law.” Therefore, each will be removed from commenting, as each has requested. If, at some point, either of you desire to return, under the conditions of Cleansing Fire’s disclaimer and policies, just contact CF administration and you’ll be welcome back.
It has been brought to my attention that I had made some typing errors in my previous comments. I meant to type PARISH, not PARIAH. My sincere apologies for any confusion for misinterpretation that resulted. That’s what happens when you have to type and care for a newborn at the same time.
Prayers for Fr. Paul English as well as all the different mass communities in Kateri Tekakwitha Parish, as he awaits a new assignment. May he be blessed in his new assignment. Change can pose challenges, but it is inevitable and part of life. God be with us and help all of us through this transition. Please God bless Bishop Salvatore Matano and help him to choose wisely, the next pastor of St. Kateri Tekakwitha Parish. And please bless the new incoming pastor of St. Kateri Tekakwitha Mass Community and help him to embrace and support all the mass communities that meet within St. Kateri Tekakwitha Parish.
Many religious communities within at least the last thirty years have rethought their commitment to various parishes in different dioceses they served in different provinces of the United States, and have pulled out of many of their prior commitments to concentrate their members in selected areas. One order that pulled out of the Diocese of Rochester over 22 years ago, cited it was for reasons having to do with community life per their Provincial. The Provincial stated as their numbers in the community went down, they had many parishes with only one or two members of their religious order present. He cited that there were a number of parishes with one priest present as the sole occupant of that parish rectory. In a nutshell, he conveyed the solitary assignment and living arrangements were not in line with premise of being a religious community, and it was also not healthy or beneficial to those members of the religious order and the community as a whole. He stated they were pulling out of many parishes in the province and concentrating members in certain areas where there would be multiple members of the same order to a parish and rectory, so they could have community life together observing their rule.
Applause during Mass causes me pause.
I utter “Amen” after exceptional music or exceptional Homily.
When married couples are introduced or congratulated for longevity or whatever I utter “Thanks Be To God” or “ God Bless”.
Applause? Only to or for God….
there is a reason the Brazilians will be down to only 20 or so priests under the age of 65 in the United States. Like other mostly liberal orders, they have brought this on themselves, as a lack of orthodoxy leads to a dearth of vocations. As to the situation at Saint Kateri Tekakwitha rumor has it that the public baptism of the infant of a lesbian “married” couple at a Sunday liturgy led to numerous faithful St Kateri families leaving the parish.
When you consider that just 10 years ago there were 5 parishes, and something like 15 Sunday masses in what is now Saint Kateri parish, and now they are three parish buildings and 6 rather sparsely attended Sunday mass, it’s difficult to have much regret about the Basilians leaving town. The actions of Father Tank and Father English have been well documented on this site, and our own native Father Rosica causes one to shake one’s head. Let us pray that Bishop Matano assigns a good, holy and orthodox priest to lead and hopefully rebuild the parish.
Regarding the quote from Pope Benedict XVI above: i have heard Bishop Salvatore Matano talk about the holiness of the Mass and the emphasis being on God. I am not able to quote him word for word for sentences, but I heard him say with regard to all who preside at Mass, “It’s not my show!” He went on to relay that the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass was God’s show. He relayed scenarios when the emphasis was on the individual rather than on God. He relayed one place where a particular man would sing “How Great Thou Art” and others chided that they thought he was singing about him self rather than God.
I think that we all run the risk, at least in some part, and at some time, of showcasing some talent/gift we are given, rather than giving upmost, total attention and emphasis on God. Discernment is needed because there is a fine line. Those who are particularly talented/gifted in some way, run the bigger risk.
Many years ago, I was at an Evening Mass at Our Lady of Victory Church downtown, and an older visiting Redemptorist priest was filling in. When listening to him speak, it appeared he had suffered some neurological event or disease. His speech had a very unusual, yet consistent rhythmic pattern throughout, which would would begin and end with each phrase, before pausing, and beginning another phrase. It was a feat and special sacrifice just for him to say the Mass. As he was speaking, I looked up at a Station of the Cross close to where I was sitting, and it was “Jesus Is Stripped.” I then thought regarding that priest.”He doesn’t have to worry about impressing anyone.” I thought of that type of humility. It was enough for that priest to be able to speak the words of the Mass.
A friend of mine told me that he was personally invited by a particular priest in this diocese to come to a upcoming Sunday Mass at this particular church, because he wanted him to witness something special he had prepared. (I think this was before Bishop Salvatore Matano was installed as the bishop of Rochester). My friend relayed that the readings for that Sunday had the theme of “running the race.” He stated that after the readings and Gospel, this priest began stripping on the altar. He first took off his vestments and alb. When he began taking off his pants, the congregation let out sounds of shock and surprise, but the priest had running shorts underneath. He also had a running shirt. My friend said he then changed from his black shoes into his running sneakers and preceded to run laps around the church. Parishioners were cheering him on as he continued to keep running laps around the church. My friend said people were taking out their smartphones and recording it, and it had been put on the Internet. (I think it was probably taken down because I searched for it, and could not find it). I think it is very unusual and inappropriate for a priest to strip and change into running attire on the altar and run laps around the church during Mass. I think that priest meant well and thought it was a good way to energize the Mass and illustrate “running the race with Christ.” But how much was he showcasing his athletic prowess and how much was he showcasing God?
I have found the most deeply spiritual, reverent worship during Mass is when the presider is looking to God, and pointing us to God, rather than to himself.
All Masses whether they are Novus Ordo, Tridentine Mass, or the Ordinariate Rite, (Melkite Rite and other Rites included as well), are all capable of being worshiped in beauty, awe, and reverence. I do think that facing ad orientum may help facilitate the emphasis on God during Mass.
“The Latin Mass attendance really hasn’t changed since the days it was held at St. Stanislaus.”
Actually, Interstate Catholic, the average attendance at the Tridentine Mass has increased from the totals at St. Stanislaus.
Our average Sunday number is 140 at St. Thomas the Apostle (since we moved there in Nov 2014).
At St. Stan’s it was 90, at least in my time (I joined the Latin Mass Community in 2010).
Diane Harris
I was moved by your comments of concern regarding the Chinese underground Catholics and the plight of Syrian Catholics. I am filled with so many memories of the different rites of Catholic Mass and cultural customs during the last 20 years of my life. I appreciated the experience of attending these different rites.
I was in Japan for an international conference in 1999 and found that there are over 500,000 Catholics in Japan ( 0.5% of the population) They have over 1500 priests and 16 dioceses and over 800 parishes. This is a miracle when one considers the persecution and execution of Christian Catholics since the 16th century, when Jesuits first came to Japan as missionaries, to the present day. The Christian Community had been exiled to Nagasaki or to the outlying islands.
The Urakami Cathedral in Nagasaki was ground zero for the August 9th, 1945 atomic bombing of Nagasaki.The Catholic Community of Nagasaki was inside with their Jesuit priests praying, just 3 days after The Feast of the Transfiguration, when the first atomic bomb was dropped on Hiroshima.
My dear friend, Father Albert Evans s.s.c.c., now deceased, was a missionary to Japan during the persecution of Christians. He had to row out to the many islands of Japan, where Catholic Christians were exiled, to visit them. Father Albert Evans recounted to me one poignant memory with tears in his eyes. He recounted how he rowed out to an island, after he was told that a Catholic man was dying and that he wanted to confess his sins and receive Extreme Unction. When Father Evans came upon the island, he found a great many rice paper scrolls streaming from the branches of the trees and found the man, lying dead at the base of a tree. He had spent the last hours of his life writing down his sins on those rice paper scrolls, for which he sought absolution.
While doing emergency medical missions in Haiti after the January 12, 2010 Haiti Earthquake, I saw the ruins of the Cathedral of Port au Prince ( Cathédrale Notre Dame de L’Assomption). Archbishop Joseph Serge Miot and Vicar General Charles Benoit were killed inside the structure. I was with a large gathering of Haitians in outside worship which lasted for hours. Many walked miles to come. I was allowed to teach the young children Sunday school in French. I saw a group of older adults baptized after spending a year in Catechism and scriptural study. I heard them renounce Satan and say their baptism promises. They were all converts who left a life of practicing voodoo. To see their heartfelt, joyful worship after experiencing such devastation and loss,reduced me to tears. There is surely a joy which transcends our circumstances.
In 2011, I was sent to India along with 9 other international faculty members to teach basic and advanced disaster life support and other courses of the A.M.A./ N.D.L.S.F. at U.N. sponsored Chennai Emergency Management Exercise at Sri Ramachandra University. It ended with a city wide disaster drill involving all hospitals, ambulances, EMS, Fire Services, the Military, Police, physicians, surgeons, nurses, aides, hospitals, and 2,000 volunteer victims. One of the faculty members was our leader, who was a physician both in India and in the United States. He came with his wife. They were Malabar Christians, Mar Thoma Catholics.I wondered why he had brought us to Kerala from Chennai, before we flew back to Chennai. He took us to see many sites and experience many things. He brought us to the beach where St.Thomas landed from the Arabian Sea to preach the Gospel. There is a Malabar Church and a shrine there on the beach. The same kind of ancient, large wooden vessel that St. Thomas traveled in are found in numbers on the beach. They are ancient styled fishing boats and the fishermen still use the same type of nets. Dr. Abraham was excited to tell me that this is now considered a shrine in the Roman Catholic Church and Pope John Paul II had visited it.
One evening, Dr. Abraham and his wife had a chartered bus take us outside of Chennai to Mount St. Thomas. This is a hillock where St. Thomas lived in a cave overlooking the Indian Ocean. A small church and shrine are situated on the site where St. Thomas was martyred by a Brahman spear. He had enraged a local Brahman ruler after his wife and children had converted to Christianity and were baptized by St. Thomas. The first church was in ruins, so the Portuguese built a small church and shrine on the site in the 16th century. There are 14 stations of the cross on the way up the hill. The church in English is called, ” Our Lady of Expectation.” The Portuguese didn’t understand oriental cultural practices associated with worship, so they declared these heretical and forbid them. They tried to instill western cultural traditions.They caused much blood shed, further divisions, and the bloody revolt of Mar Thoma Christians.
The shrine church and the hillock now celebrates diversity. There are several masses per day from dawn to dusk in several Indian languages, Syrian, and English in the Malankara Rite, the Malabar Rite, and Latin Rite which are all in communion with Rome. Pope John Paul II visited this shrine church and the flourishing seminary there. There are other added special holy day observances which are Indian or Syrian in origin. The church holds the love feast for the poor daily. One has to take off their sandals or shoes and socks( leaving them outside) and enter the church barefoot for worship for any of the rites.The relatively small amount of wooden benches where pews would normally be placed, promotes the sitting space for only the disabled and the elderly. We all knelt on the stone floor during 6:00pm Mass. The fact that these three rites can be observed in the same place and in many languages under the communion of Rome celebrates the fact that we are One Body with the same baptism, one profession of faith, and we rely on the Holy Spirit for guidance, charity, and discernment.
I tend to think of some comments on this thread as “first world problems.” While I may not favor the Mass in one form, I rejoice that my brothers and sisters can worship in the form which they find most meaningful and edifying in faith to them. We should all be grateful to God and for Bishop Matano for being so supportive of all of the forms of Mass Community present in the Diocese of Rochester.
True Faith, you have written a magnificent summary of your experiences. Thank you for sharing. And I note that, under the Holy Spirit’s guidance,you have written so eloquently of St. Thomas today, on the eve of his Feast Day tomorrow, Dec. 21, under the centuries old calendar of the Roman Martyrology. Thank you for expending this effort for the whole CF community.
Diane Harris Thank you. I had not realized that it was the eve of the Feast Day of St. Thomas. I probably would have found this out if I had looked it up on the Internet Site for Mount St. Thomas.
I so often think of these faith communities where I have visited. They have impressed upon me the mystery of how the community of believers worships and flourishes in the midst of persecution, hardship, disaster and great personal loss.
Latin Mass can also be heard at st Francis Church in Phelps as part of St Peter’s parish.They have even installed a communion rail to assist in the traditional reception of the Blessed Sacrament.
“I agree that parishes SHOULD offer a weekly Latin mass. Is this likely to happen in the future? Unlikely, given the lack of formation in seminary to properly celebrate the Latin mass.”
i believe this training is offered at Catholic University.
i believe this training is offered at Catholic University.
I may be wrong but I don’t think that there is an interest in having an added Latin Mass in every parish in the Rochester Diocese.
1. This would be an added mass (and burden) to the existing number of masses per weekend that the ever diminishing number of diocesan parish priests would be responsible for officiating at.
2. Are there large numbers of parishioners ( besides the Latin Mass Community at St. Thomas the Apostle Church) who are requesting a Latin Mass in their own parish every Sunday? I doubt it.
3. I usually go to the Ordinariate Mass because its beautiful liturgy, ancient traditions, and practices which are closer to what I experienced as a child attending Mass before Vatican II. I made my First Holy Communion and My Confirmation a few years before the first changes of Vatican II were instituted. I remember all the Latin that I had to learn, as well as the slap across my face by the bishop to remind me that I must be ready to suffer all things, even death, for the sake of Jesus Christ.
4. Both the Latin Mass and the Ordinariate Mass are older, more traditional Masses and they tend to last much longer than the Novo Ordo Mass. There are no female altar servers,and there is no role of Eucharistic minister. There are male acolytes.This would need to be explained to those who usually attend the Novo Ordo Mass.There are several other differences which would be worth mentioning.
5. I attend the Novo Ordo Mass at different churches within the Rochester Diocese when I have to work the weekend and I’m unable to attend Ordinariate Mass at 11:30 on a Sunday. The Novo Ordo Mass is usually over within 35 minutes to 45 minutes in most churches. This is what the parishioners are used to. Both the atmosphere and the mode of dress is more casual. In summer, many parishioners attend Mass in their shorts,their t-shirts or tank tops and their flip-flops or sandals.
6. This is worlds apart from the solemnity of the Latin Mass, where women generally dress up very modestly and wear mantillas or hats as was practiced before Vatican II. Men are usually dressed up as well. I doubt that you would find anyone attending Latin Mass while wearing shorts, a t-shirt, and flip- flops. ( I doubt that you would find anyone wearing shorts, a t-shirt, and flip- flops while attending the Ordinariate Mass as well.)
7. I really do believe that those Catholics who have desired to attend Latin Mass are already part of the Latin Mass Society at St. Thomas the Apostle.