Cleansing Fire

Defending Truth and Tradition in the Roman Catholic Church

What sort of Mass did the Vatican II Fathers envision?

May 25th, 2016, Promulgated by Bernie



Liturgical conservatives and progressives argue endlessly about this. Their argument will never be resolved, both because Sacrosanctum Concilium¬†was and the subsequent magisterium has been self-contradictory, but also because neither side in the debate is willing to be honest about the historical facts. I am sorry to be harsh, but having read the output of both sides of the debate over a number of years, it is time it was said…

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One Response to “What sort of Mass did the Vatican II Fathers envision?”

  1. snowshoes says:


    Great article by Dr. Shaw. All the great world religions, Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, Shinto, pretty much require their adherents to learn to read, write and speak their respective ancient languages in order to learn the religion, and pray the religious texts.

    Now, we know that Christ through the Apostles, under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, did not require that new gentile Christians become Jews first, so unlike the other religions, we do not regard the “words on the page” as having some mystical reality, as some religions do. We are to worship in Spirit and Truth. So in a sense, the Magisterium is free, as it did in the early centuries in the West, to transition from using Greek as the liturgical language to using primarily Latin. That transition, about which I have only a glancing familiarity, seemed to go pretty well…

    Ss. Cyril and Methodius wrote down slavic, creating a new alphabet for it, translated the Bible and liturgy, and permitted the Slavs to worship in their language for the most part, back in the 800s. So being an old fart and loving the Latin, I would be happy to attend the TLM and sing chant and polyphony, if it was available here in shoeshoeland.

    Is it the case that in Africa in the mid 1900s there was a desire for a use of the local languages? Perhaps the good work of SS. C&M would have been, or still could be, a model for bringing new civilizations into the Church liturgically.

    Now, we have the duty as good parishioners, to lobby for the Good, the True and the Beautiful in our liturgy, and chanting the ordinary parts in Latin. Join the never Haugen (et al) movement! The TLM is legal, so we have to do the good work of supporting those priests, primarily young now, who do, or would, say the Latin Mass. It is all about praying for the Blessed Trinity’s guidance and leadership and for the inspiration of our Holy Father and the whole clergy.

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